Lizzie: [00:00:00] hello and

Nicola: welcome to the female leaders on fire podcast. And I am your host. So I’m Nicola Buckley. I am the coach that works with women at the very top. Corporate organizations, helping them to find their fires, that passion, that purpose, that excitement. So they can have more impact, more influence and income as a result, but also be a real force for good and change in their organization.

So today I’m super excited because I’ve got a brilliant guest on with me today. So I’ve got Lizzie Martin with me here today, and we’re going to be talking all about supporting women at the top returning to work specifically after maternity. Um, we were just actually talking about not only is there a gender pay gap, there’s also a motherhood pay gap.

So just to introduce Lizzie before she introduces herself. So Lizzie is an executive career and leadership coach. So she has consulted globally in people’s strategy and female leadership [00:01:00] development and business development across a range of different industries. So she now specializes in there and it’s really needed, which is.

Parental transition. So really with a focus on strengthening that female talent pipelines, that latent talent, those already in the business, especially after maternity leave and equipping leaders to create a brilliant returns work experience through returners. So we’re going to be talking today about the challenges that professional women face when they’re have that maternity leave.

We’ve had this huge change in identity in their lifestyle, and they’re coming back into work, how to really support them, but also use this as a point in your career to really leverage your leadership program. And what you can do is align managers, sport, returning talent. So welcome today, Lizzie. I’m super excited that you’re here.

Lizzie: Thank you so much. And having me and having me on as a guest to talk about a topic that I am so passionate

Nicola: about.

Lizzie: Excellent. And you are on my

Nicola: hit list for a little while. So I’m really glad we’ve got this in the diary. We’re here

Lizzie: today. So yeah. Thank

Nicola: you for your time. So Lizzie, [00:02:00] if you could just start, I’ve given you a bit of an introduction, but if you could just start with just giving a bit of your backstory and how you’ve come to be doing the brilliant work that you’re doing.

Yeah,

Lizzie: absolutely. So my career started off on the graduate scheme. I was working for John Lewis and Waitrose, and I worked in a number of managerial and leadership positions for a decade plus, but it was only when I went on my first maternity leave. Did. See first hand how complex it is to weave together the Juul responsibilities of parenting and new motherhood with a professional, ambitious career.

And whilst I was on my first maternity leave, I met loads of new friends. I met loads of new friends through NCT, lots of other women who will try to hold down high profile, challenging jobs. And they were on their first intensity and they was thinking, I don’t know how I’m going to be able to make this work, how I can [00:03:00] kind of balance the two.

So I took my leadership background and thought, right, I’m going to marry this up with my coaching skills. And I’m going to do something about this particular transition and how. Yeah, brilliant. I

Nicola: love it. When we talk about this transition, just describe in your own words, what is those? There’s obviously like a practical part of going on from being away from your colleagues and obviously being away from the office for a longer period of time, but there’s also a huge shift in identity.

So what are the, what are the challenges around this transition?

Lizzie: Yeah, that’s a brilliant question. The, the breadth of challenges are just absolutely enormous, but they come down to three main pillars. So I kind of put these into categories. So you’ve got career you’ve then got connection and you’ve got confidence.

So the first challenge, which is probably the most common challenge that I see with women is. Being able to continue to [00:04:00] have a career, a job that gives you autonomy that allows you to use your strengths and helps you to continue to develop, to learn. Continue on professional career trajectory. So the biggest challenge for many women is that they feel as though their career gets derailed and that they’ve got to downshift their careers, like dropping down to four days a week, or maybe moving into a less senior position.

So that’s one of the biggest challenges. Then there’s this piece around belonging and connection. So you’re awake. Your company for a period of time. And it’s really important that we feel as though we belong to a team that we’re recognized by others, that we have this sense of belongingness and connection, and that can be massively, massively loss.

When you’re absent from the workforce when you’re not there, you’re out of sight, out [00:05:00] of mind, so very much. And I think that probably links with the identity piece as well, because when you feel disconnected as though you don’t have a place in the team that you’re not getting that regular recognition from others, It can really impact how you perceive yourself and what your identity is,

Nicola: comes with that connection to the people around you and to being, having a certain level of peer group.

And suddenly that’s just, just gone for an extended period of time. So you lose that sense of identity. And with all those connections around

Lizzie: the kind of feeding. Yes. And let’s say you felt fit. You might’ve spent 15 plus years building up your professional profile, developing these stakeholders, you know, investing in status and achievement, and suddenly you feel quite removed from that part of your life.

It can feel very difficult to identify. How [00:06:00] you’re giving to get back to that. You’re wearing your leggings and your t-shirt and you’re scraping off baby food from the floor. They can feel so different to what you were doing. Six nine months earlier. So it’s a massive shift. And that links with the third C, which is confidence.

So we know that when women go back to work after maternity leave less than a fests, feel confident in their capabilities. So having that confidence in your capabilities and your contribution so that you can continue to deliver, deliver excellence and unlock your potential. And I think when you have your confidence and your delivery, and you have that sense of pride and achievement, and that can very much be taken away from you momentarily, potentially, but it can have really long lasting impact.

Nicola: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And I love those. I love those, the conciseness of those three, because [00:07:00] like you said, there’s such a myriad of challenges to actually bring it into those free. He makes it quite tangible and understandable. And hopefully for women that are going through this have been through this, they can really identify with those three different areas and just know that this isn’t, this isn’t unique to you.

It’s your story and your experience. But actually with that, there’s just a really collective, this is a really collective experience and journey.

Lizzie: And this is what links to intrinsic motivation. This is what we need. Particularly when we look at millennials, what do millennials look for? What motivates them to work and who they work with and what organization they choose to work for?

It generally comes down to these three areas, having an opportunity to develop in your career, feeling a sense of belongingness and the team. And the confidence.

Nicola: So if we split this out into two, then, so there’s the women themselves that have going through this and then coming back into it and then the organizations.

So [00:08:00] if we start with the women that are coming back into work, what can they do to kind of support themselves? And then we’ll talk separately about what organizations can do to support them coming

Lizzie: back into the work. Yeah, let’s start with the women. And so I think the most important thing that you can do as a woman is to think about your return to work before you’ve even left.

So being able to put some plans in place before you depart can make a massive difference. And what I mean by this is making sure if we think about career progression, making sure that your ambitions have been captured. Yeah, because it’s really common to go on leave and for your line managers to change, it’s really common for that to be some structural changes.

And perhaps those conversations that you’ve had over a coffee or a glass of wine that stuck with a certain person. And then if that person then leaves. So just the conversation that you’ve had about your ambitions. [00:09:00] Putting in place a plan and making sure that your goals are documented somewhere and thinking about before you leave, how you want to maintain that level of connection and communication with the business.

So how do you want it to be kept up to date? How do you want to be informed of progression opportunities? How do you want us to be invited to. Events, because I think if it’s not clear, then what happens is people are on the side of caution and do nothing. Yeah. Yeah. So they don’t tell you about things.

They don’t invite you to events and then you can feel even more disconnected.

Nicola: Yeah. So mindset that probably also think, well, you just had had a new baby or just about to have a new baby. Does it feel like too much? Can we involve them? Can we not? So I love that. I love that clarity from the very beginning, a new site.

I think that from an Europe science point of view, that’s creating that prediction response of [00:10:00] actually, yes, these are the things that I would love to be part of or be invited to. And these are the things that are probably for now. I’m not going to be part of, part of what I commit to. Yeah. I really love that.

Yeah.

Lizzie: And, and building, building up your, your work advocates before you leave. So thinking about who, your allies, who is going to speak on your behalf when you’re not there. So if a promotion opportunity does come up is as somebody sitting in that room that is going to mention your name and it’s not, um, it’s not just about promotion, it’s about loads of other things, but I think that’s probably a really clear example that many will resonate with who, who has got your.

He was looking after your voice whilst John’s not there. So really starting to think about how you’re going to sweat your assets, how you’re going to use your career advocates, how you communicate with them, what your career plans are, so that when you are absent, you’ve got people working on your behalf and you don’t.

Forgotten [00:11:00] or out of sight out of mind, as I mentioned earlier.

Nicola: Yeah. And I think, I think that’s so powerful and that’s what I’m, I’m running the leadership programs that I do for corporates. One of the multi-site I focus on is leading where your relationships and part of that is having your supporters, having your, what you could call your career advocates.

But also we just talked on another podcast episode just about actually for someone that you read. I’m inspired by all, uh, aspire to be like that’s in a role modeling, a great form of leadership that you really, that really you feel passionate about is actually come up because person become an informal mentor doesn’t you don’t need to wait for the permission of it being a formal structure.

Almost those people will be, like you said, the voice of when you’re not there, they’re still your advocates. They’re still your sponsors. They’re still know what you’re capable of them. How does a particular role align with you? So that’s happening whilst you’re not there, which is just setting those seeds and saying that those relationships are before you’re out of the business.

I really love [00:12:00] that.

Lizzie: It’s definitely and definitely focusing on what you can control and being proactive about it because I think you hit on a really good point there Niccolo, which is you don’t. To wait to be given these opportunities, you can go and find them. And having a mentor is really critical. Uh, we, we know that women that can see role models are more like.

So to, to make progress in their careers. So if you’re heading into maternity leave, if you’re able to find a role model and mentor who is a female leader and a mother that is going to have a really positive impact on your experience, because you’re able to see. Happen. You’re able to see that it, that it is possible.

And this is something I think that you can do as an individual, but also organizations can create mentor and buddy schemes for that talent. So [00:13:00] having that kind of peer matching or buddy matching or mentor matching before you leave can really help give you the confidence that actually it is going to be possible to leave and come back as a parent and still make

Nicola: it.

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And I love, uh, really the statement for me is so powerful that you can’t be what you can’t see. So if you don’t have those role models in the business, if you’re not, and we’re talk about the organizations, what they can do in the moment, but if you don’t see those people leading the way it’s actually can, is that something that you can become a role model in yourself?

Don’t always have to wait for that, that you can be the person that’s creating that, that role model for others. And actually as a leader. Yes. Responsibility to yourself and your career, but also people that are looking up the way to you. You’ll you’re effectively lighting the way for others as well on a path that might not yet be known or might not be yet created.

So it’s that brave retool, most challenged things that don’t fit with you or to challenge behaviors or practices that are [00:14:00] in the organization that don’t actually support you to be that role model. So if we, we seem to naturally have kind of evolved on to talking about organizations, but what can, what can, what are some best practices that organizations can put in place for just to really unlock this talent that is coming back into work.

That actually it’s going to be a fresh, it’s going to be a shift in identity, but there’s also going to be a different appetite. Isn’t there after an extended period of time away from the.

Lizzie: Yeah. So I think it all comes down to the role of leaders. So if you are a people manager, you’re leading somebody who is going on or coming back from parental leave, I believe that you absolutely unlock the key to.

That retention and also how well they’re then able to come back and thrive. And the most important thing is to challenge the assumptions and biases that you might hold around. That person. We always hear, they have. Often somebody goes on [00:15:00] maternity leave or goes on shared parental leave. And there’s an assumption that they’re going to come back as less ambitious or less committed or less focused than they were before.

We can focus on what policies we need to have in place to support returners. But I think this is beyond policies. This is more about how do you put into practice brilliant leadership and challenging your assumptions and biases is hands down the number one thing, and therefore treating each individual as an individual and not creating this broad brush approach that everyone’s going to have the same experience.

And everybody’s going to be. The same things when they return. And it’s so unique and personal. And the second thing I’ve put, sort of goes with this, it’s about empathy. So about leading with empathy, and I’ve got some statistics around this because I love the [00:16:00] statistic. I am following.

Nicola: You can just, I love when I have my views as well, but I can find some stats to really support that as well.

Lizzie: So if we look at empathy, if we look at empathetic leadership in the context of your team member going on and coming back from leave, and this isn’t just maternity leave, this is any form of leave. The statistics I’ve got here are, if you are a leader, display empathy, 61% of your team are going to be more innovative.

If you are an empathetic leader, 76% of your team are going to be more engaged. And then when we look at retention, which is critical at this point, 57% of white women and 60% of women of color are less likely to leave their workplace. If they’ve got an empathetic. Wow.

Nicola: So powerful. I, I, I, I could sense it and I obviously teach and coach a lot around there anyway, but wow.

Just to have, [00:17:00] like I said, tabs a step to actually back ups, so powerful and really hits home. The difference that it makes

Lizzie: a difference and retention at this point of a female career is already a massive challenge. You know, we know that another statistic is that 74% of women plan to go back to their employer at the ends of maternity leave, but only 24%.

I’m not probably linked with the fact that they don’t feel as though they’re going back into an organization that can empathize with compassion, that current experience. So another statistic linked to this as work life balance. So 86% of individuals that have an empathetic leader are better able to navigate the demands of home and work.

Wow. So if you, if you have empathy, look, all those brilliant things, you have more innovative team, more engaged team. Your [00:18:00] retention is better, and your team are going to have work-life balance, which we know links to productivity and business before. So

Nicola: that makes it into. Business transformational, not into like a nice to have.

It’s not a lip service. It’s not something to pay lip service to. It’s something that has a very bottom line impact because if you’re it, for example, if it’s mentioned numbers are much higher, there’s an actual cost to every time someone leaves the business, you have to bring someone in to replace that person.

I’m not

Lizzie: that’s upwards of 30,000 pounds to replace a professional. So it absolutely impacts the bottom line, but also we’re talking about trying to get more women into leadership positions. And we know that businesses that have got better gender diversity at the top are more profitable as well. So shifting away from lip service, I mean, I definitely shifted away from thinking that this is lip service and I’m really hoping that we can.

The part of that [00:19:00] movement, where for future generations. Supporting returners supporting mothers in the workplace is something more than a nice to have and a techniques exercise, which I think it probably still is for many people.

Nicola: Yeah. I th I think the organizations that I speak to, I think there was a shift, I think there is starting to be a shift.

I think again, There are many things locked down. The pandemic is kind of bought a lot of these issues to the fold. Actually, there’s a whole different dimension now around hybrid working and for women that’s actually increased in may the hundred year gender pay gap at 136 years. And really just for me, like you said, my, why do I work with women?

I get asked that question quite a lot. And it’s like, well, there’s a huge gender pay gap anyway, but also. This isn’t this isn’t my crusade. That’s just me. This is, this is my purpose and passion. I love what I do. And I think I know that there’s a real, there’s a real impact on [00:20:00] people’s lives behind what I do, because I see that every day with my clients, but at the sharp end of the business, we know that.

Like you said that half more quality at the board level across gender, but also color and race and age and everything. There’s more employee loyalty. There’s more openness to new ideas. There’s more bottom line profitability. So actually. And your biggest latent talent pool is actually within your business.

And unlocking that should be a huge focus rather than just always looking external, especially for those more senior roles. So this is, yeah. So as part of it, it’s my passion, my purse, similar to you. And it’s a crusade and something that I love on my mission. But if for businesses that are already there and experience it, it’s, it’s hugely transformational.

It’s, it’s an obvious way that you can have an immediate change in changing your dynamics and impact that for some people at the top might be really uncomfortable, but actually other people at the top is it’s. Yes, this is what needs to happen. So it’s almost the two combined. How [00:21:00] do we, how do we help?

Not only the women and the parents that are going through that transition, but also how do we help organizations see that this is a latent pool of talent that can unlock a business transformation. This isn’t a nice to have, it needs to have. So,

Lizzie: absolutely. And it’s going to be the difference between compressive.

Yeah, those companies that are prioritizing this, so going to see competitive advantage and we are seeing, and I’ll get back to millennials, anybody that was born after 1980, which is going to be, I think there’s something like by 20 25, 70 5% of the workforce is going to be millennials or something along those lines.

So we know that millennials. So different things from work. We don’t look just for the pay packet. We look at everything else as well, around [00:22:00] culture and leadership and purpose at work. So changing that thinking from the top is going to massively impact competitive advantage in being a good to attract the best talent.

Yeah, I talk a lot about talent retention, but this is also about how do you attract

Nicola: and I think it is it’s that true task. Isn’t it? Cause millennials cause I’m the generation four. So I’m gen X or gen Y uh, anyway generation before millennials. So. I think there was a lot more. If I look back at like my, my dad, for example, my dad worked for the same organization for 39 years and it would have been 40 years, but he was, he went through a really awful experience, which meant that he suffered with anxiety and depression ended up leaving just for his choice in his health.

And you know, that typical career of staying with the same organization. That’s, that’s not something we’re going to have chapters to our careers now that are very, very different in [00:23:00] industries or maybe our own business. And millennials will vote by just leaving. If that culture isn’t right, or they don’t have the support, or they don’t see the opportunities for progression and that’s men and women and across however you identify, it’s just like, this is not good enough.

We’re not going to tolerate this. It was just, I’m going to move for someone that does have that, that does have more holiday, or it’s going to support me to get to the next level, not give me vague, vague feedback in a review, but actually give me something really concrete over this is your path to your promotion or your pay rise.

Lizzie: And I think four times is there if the average of millennials. Change careers in their lifetime. So higher to retire is no more. The plan that we’re seeing individuals go out and try and achieve maybe. Somewhere between three and five times is going to start to become the norm, not the exception, but the norm.

Nicola: Yeah. Yeah. So we talked a lot about how organizations

Lizzie: support, but also how you can support

Nicola: yourself. What about [00:24:00] for the men that are coming back into work after having been on that parental leave and maybe not having the same level of parental leave as.

Lizzie: Yeah, I th I mean, men are absolutely going to be a massive key to being able to succeed in this space.

Say from a policy perspective, I believe that we need to have better paid parental leave for men. So at the moment they get two weeks paternity leave and they may have opportunities page, but it’s not straightforward. And it’s very difficult for lots of men to take time off, to be with. Family and support their wife because of the way that is structured.

And because we genuinely say the fathers being depressed, when is, and, and therefore it’s not financially viable, but if we open up the dialogue around a father’s role in child’s CAD responsibilities, we’re going to see better parity at home. And that is going to that. Have [00:25:00] a positive impact on how we see better parity in the workplace.

So supporting the dialogue, I think is something that everybody can start to contribute. Immediately, you know, talking about a father’s journey, talking about men needing work flexibility. Um, but it’s not a mother’s issue or a women’s issue to need to have flexible working to do the school run or the nursery pickup.

And it goes back to challenging the assumptions and the biases. It’s very difficult for lots of men, particularly if they’re the first time. In their workplace or on their team to say, you know, I need, I need a bit of space saver, sort of 4:00 PM, 5:00 PM because I’m picking up my children. And I still met with quite a lot of challenge and ego and resistance.

Uh, so I think opening up the dialogue is really key and encouraging. [00:26:00] Fathers to play a much more active role they want to. So we know that men want to have a more active role within the baby. And it’s just about how can we support them to do that because it will have a positive impact. Yeah. I love that.

Nicola: I love that. And just when we’re talking about men and women, but just being a new parent and that transition. So I loved when we, when we talked about having you on the podcast, you will say. Mentioned about how you can actually use this as a point and like aside endorsing your career to really. You know, really impact on your own leadership profile and just make it not an, almost like an opportunity.

What are the ways that you can do that? So if you’re a new parent coming back into work, what are the ways that you can use it almost as an opportunity to maybe increase your leadership profile, have more leadership impact and influence. So

Lizzie: there’s two things that come to mind. So the first one is the profile and the second piece is the impact.

So if we look at [00:27:00] profile, when you’ve been absent for a period of time for 6, 10, 12 plus months, you’ve got an opportunity to reconnect and to think about your visibility. All of your stakeholders. There is no better opportunity than to say I’m coming back in hell. I have 20 minutes at a time, have a coffee to understand what’s changed from my access and what your business priorities are right now.

How I can support you with that. So you, you’re now part of this really, really special club. So being a working parents, it brings people together. So it doesn’t matter where you sit in the hierarchy or the. Having a chat with somebody about sleep patterns or with your child, or about your favorite playgroup, it brings people together.

So it gives you direct access to people that you may not have previously thought about building a professional [00:28:00] relationship. So really thinking. About that, you know, that kind of exclusive club that you will now pass off and how you can use your return to work, to think about your profile and who you’re getting in front of.

And then when you’re having these conversations, thinking about, okay, How do you now leverage your skills? So this is the impact piece. So when you are on your leave and when you become a new mother that all new and old school changes that take place, and this means that you are actually sharpening some of your skills that are going to make you a much more impactful and effective leader.

So. Quite a lot of neuroscience that’s been done in this area and there’s an individual called Shereen for him. And she talks about how those first two years of motherhood, what we’re seeing in women’s brains is a [00:29:00] slight shrinkage in the gray matter. Areas of your brain, which might sound like, oh, well that’s baby brain.

But actually what it’s about is about your brain becoming more efficient. So you see the gray matter, get smaller. What we see white matter, get bigger and the white matter is all about. Processing and synchronicity, which controls the social cognition and emotion. So in layman’s terms, what this means is that you now have better emotional connection with.

Around you were able to chew on into the motives of other people better. And you’re able to process critical information and problem solve far more effectively because of the way that your brain has changed, because you’ve been spending all this time, adapting to the needs, needs, and demands of a small child.

And [00:30:00] that’s where we see the neuroplasticity. Sharpening your leadership skills. So we talk about baby brain. It’s not baby brain. It’s an absolute superpower. When we think back to the statistics I gave earlier about being an empathetic leader, you’re coming back as a more empathetic leader because of the changes that have gone on in Europe.

Yeah,

Nicola: I love that. I love that because like you said, that I think there’s this misconception, that baby brain, it’s a negative thing. And you know, obviously it’s going to be an impact on your sleep and your energy and all those huge things, but actually there’s some real positives and just embracing those things actually.

You are going to show up on your problem solving skills because actually most days, I, I assume not being, uh, being a, want to be older mother, the things that immediately need solving because a small, a small, a small person is it depends

Lizzie: depending on

Nicola: you. It’s like, I don’t know what to do. [00:31:00] Silva do something.

See what happens. See what works. Not

Lizzie: that I think problem solving. I think resilience. I think your resilience gets tested. Prioritizing you become your master prioritizing. You’re constantly having to weight, weigh up the pros and cons of what is the most important thing right now. You need to do I let my child put their finger in the socket or do I let the pastor fall over on the hall constantly in.

In that kind of mode. So it, it really does elevate. So the skills that you already possess, and I think it’s worthwhile taking time to reflect upon those skills and to think about how you’re going to weave them back into work, how you’re going to leverage those skills and communicate that that is how you’re now coming in stronger and more impactful.

Yeah,

Nicola: I [00:32:00] absolutely love that. I love that. Is there a final message Lizzie that you’d like to leave with my audience about there’s so much from today? It’s been absolutely brilliant, but is there a one specific final message you’d like to leave with?

Lizzie: I think for me, it’s about challenging the narrative around motherhood, having to be a barrier to leadership progression.

And how can we see it as an enabler of unlocking potential? I think if we all reframe some of the beliefs and the assumptions that we hold around, it, we’re going to make it easier for working parents to thrive in both their personal lives and their professional. Yeah,

Nicola: absolutely. Absolutely. I love that.

And just. A big part of the leader, like, like we’ve talked about is you have the role, you have responsibilities, but it’s also role modeling. So part of that is challenging. Maybe processes that aren’t supportive or behaviors or assumptions and feeling safe to [00:33:00] know that, you know, you’re voicing it and you’re challenging.

You’re not just letting it continue for other people that are going to follow, follow your path. So that challenger mentality notes. Okay. It’s okay. And you’re safe to do that.

Lizzie: Yeah. And if we all do a little bit of it, you know, we’re not saying that anybody’s going to be the silver bullet of change, but if we can.

Of heart then collected within to have a great,

Nicola: absolutely. Absolutely. So just to finish it off, just as three questions that I’d like to close with. So the first one is, do you have a leader who really inspired. I’m speeding. Spite you and your

Lizzie: career. Yes. So Jacinta, all Dan Hayes, prime minister of New Zealand and a mother to a young child.

Absolutely. An inspirational leader. To me, not only is she leading with compassionate authenticity, but she act quickly and decisively and she shows not only her strengths or [00:34:00] weaknesses, which is just brilliant.

Nicola: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And everything she coped with in her first 18 months of, uh, obviously locked down in a terrorist attack and just huge changes in the country and just did it all with a small child that she was looking after and raising.

So, yeah, I absolutely love her. And I love a lot of the quotes she talks about. Where, when did vulnerability become anything apart from strength? When did it become misconceived as something that is.

Lizzie: Definitely. Definitely. And we’re seeing how she’s led through the coronavirus traits.

Nicola: Yeah, absolutely. And is there a book that you’d like to share with the audience that’s had a really a huge impact on.

Lizzie: Yeah. So I really toyed with this question for a long time, because I was like, I’ve got to bring a book to the table with it’s been written. I couldn’t shift away from atomic habits, which is written by James. And the reason I’ve picked [00:35:00] this is because there’s a part in the book that talks about progress.

And I work with my clients and in the book, he says, imagine that you are in. Sitting on the table, the Romo’s holes, and you can see a so-called that somebody could see their breath in the room is currently 25 degrees, say 25 degrees. The ice cube assessing on the table. 26 degrees, 27 degrees. It’s still a block of ice.

28 degrees, 29 degrees. It’s still there. 30 degrees, 31 degrees. It’s still sitting as a piece of ice. And only at 32 degrees, does the ice against and outs. So there’s one degree shift, 31 to 32. Not much more than the previous temperature changes. This one has unlocked the change for me. This is all about the [00:36:00] fact that break through moments are often the result of many previous actions.

You just need to get to that critical professional. The new level of performance. Yeah. And I love

Nicola: that. And I think, I think a lot of the women, we work with what I call all or nothing, women, those very much high achievers. Like I want it all. I want it all done perfectly and I want it done yesterday. I’ve always, it’s not worth it.

And I love working with them on. Small steps, create the foundation, small steps, create momentum that then lead to huge change to don’t. Don’t underestimate the taking time for yourself in the morning. Don’t underestimate the checking in with yourself and how you’re feeling don’t underestimate was setting at least one new boundary or saying no to something.

Because you’re creating a behavior change. You’re creating a new neuro connection that builds from there. And I love the momentum that you get when you see the small things working. And also the great wall of China was built a brick at a time. And now it’s one of the biggest structures in the, in [00:37:00] the world, but also can be seen from space.

So that was a brick at a time. And that at some point became so huge because someone kept laying a brick at a time. Yes.

Lizzie: Sometimes we just need to zoom out on our progress rather than since evening in so much on every single tiny detail, because we all waiting through Trico. Um, so I, that’s why I picked that book.

So I apologize. It wasn’t a female author, but I.

Nicola: Not at all. I, I loved the book as well, and I, I ha I’d forgotten about that. So yeah. Thank you for sharing that. And final question is what does find your fire mean to you?

Lizzie: So to me, in a nutshell, this is about identifying the thing that gets you up in the morning and using that to define your own version of success, that version of six test to drive you forward, rather than that.

Like [00:38:00] some other people say for me, it’s all about staying in your own lane, but defining what your lane looks like in the first place, so that you can measure yourself against what you wants to do rather than the noise from other people, which can be very noisy, particularly the points of early parents.

Yeah,

Nicola: absolutely. Absolutely. I love that. And final, final thing, just where can people find out more about the brilliant work that you’re doing today?

Lizzie: I find my website, which is what most mother.com or you can find me on LinkedIn and there is Lizzy. And also these Instagram fans, I’m also on Instagram.

Nicola: We’ll put that all in the show notes anyway, but thank you so much to say, I think we could have chat all day long with that swim. Absolutely brilliant, useful. So thank you so much. Thanks for having me. Thank you for today, everyone. And we will speak to you on the next podcast episode. We’d love to know what you thought of [00:39:00] today, and if you’re interested in having some support with just helping you to find that fire women in your organization or my contact details on this.

Thanks so much. Bye. If what I took about really resonates with you and you love what I have to say, and you have moments and flashes of inspiration from the podcast, I would invite you to get in touch, to find out how I can help you. So individually, that can be through my coaching focus from. For my VIP program, depending on how you like to learn and what will suit you, or I can help you in your organization to really help the women that you work with across the organization at all different levels.

And at that very senior level to really feel empowered and to know that they can reach the very, the most senior levels in that organization and to give them the. In who they are and the clarity, what they want to be able to get there. And we do that through workshops, do that through leadership programs, and we can do that.

Free consulting work. If you are looking for help with any of that, drop me an [00:40:00] email nycla@nicholasschoolco.com. The spelling is not the easiest. So all the details are in the show notes results I get for clients. Clients have been promoted twice in the six months we’ve worked together. They’d been invited to join the board.

They’ve gone from redundancy to being offered three dreams. They’ve gone from being pushed out of an organization to going into bigger organization and a bigger role with a bigger pay rise and just a quote from a client that particular. I’ve gone from the pit of despair. When I started working with Nick to just being really fucking happy and she is an incredibly empowered leader.

Now, if you’re not quite ready for that, you can download my overwhelmed on fire guide the details that are in the show notes, but that really helps you everyday to stay in your fire. So it helps you to clear your head, helps you to come back to what’s important to you, and it helps you to have that most impact and influence every single day.

It’s a little Quip sheet that you can just go through and take that. So go and download that. Or you can subscribe to my newsletter, which comes out every Friday, which is a [00:41:00] Roundup of the week. Really. So what’s going on in my world. What’s a blog for that week, a quick video, that’s going to help your particular subject.

And it’s all about helping female leaders to find their fire and also stats and, and any research from the industry as well. And things that I’m reading the. Um, recommendations that we’re making. So go and subscribe to that. And finally, for the podcast, if you haven’t done so already, I would love you to go and leave us a review and subscribe so that you never miss an episode.

And you’re always going to have the, when that release and doing that as well. Not only helps you, but it also means that we’re going to reach more women and we’re going to be able to start that revolution to helping female leaders to keep that. I find that fire and keep it. So keep that passion, that purpose side excitement.

So if you haven’t done that already, please go and do that. Thank you.